The Great Toilet Bowl Debate

[Head Mutant]

So, the other day Caramel comes out of our bathroom with one of *those* looks on her face and a plaintive "Honey..." on her lips. Then she procedes to kindly ask me, once again, to make sure I put the toilet seat down, else she would continue to fall into the bowl.

I didn't think that this sort of conversation happened outside of a Dave Barry column, but here we go.

What's the big, ongoing deal with women and their obsession with toilet seat lids? I don't mean for this to get negatively sexist, I'm just trying to figure out why it's such a big deal to them (according to Dave Barry).

As much as I can figure it out, here are my thoughts on what both parties are thinking:

THE MALE WHO LIFTS THE TOILET SEAT TO DO #1, THEN LEAVES IT UP

(1) Doesn't want to get pee splatter on the seat. I would think we'd get medals for this sort of compassionate thinking, but nothing doing.

(2) Considers that the effort it takes to lift something *against* the mighty force of gravity is quite enough, and assumes that his wife or woman friend would rejoice that gravity is more than willing to take over once she gives the seat a little *flick* downwards.

(3) Thinks that if a woman comes in to use the toilet and either doesn't notice the state of the seat or walks backwards into the room and never turns around, she deserves what happens next.

(4) The lifted seat offers the widest viewing area for the pretty blue ocean water left behind.

THE WOMAN WHO PREFERS THE SEAT DOWN

(1) No matter what, she has to sit to use the toilet. Since the guy has to sit 50% or so of the time as well, it makes more sense to keep it down.

(2) It looks better down, and even better with the full lid down displaying the Martha Stewart toilet lid fuzzy cover.

(3) She's bought into the whole double-standard stereotype of gender bathroom behavior, and considers it her duty to uphold woman's rightful place on the Throne.

(4) She keeps walking backwards into that bathroom and can't be bothered to turn around.

Thoughts? Don't get mean?

[pfrsue]

My thoughts are thus:

No matter whether a lady needs to deposit #1 or #2, it is necessary for her to be seated. Therefore she will not (except for cleaning purposes or things that will remain unwritten here) lift the toilet seat.

A man however, lifts the seat at least 50% of the time. Therefore, as the seat lifter, the responsibility is on him to put it back down again.

Also, mathematically speaking. If we assume that bodily functions are divided relatively equally between #1 and #2 (granted this isn't completely accurate), then a toilet shared by one male and one female would need its lid to be in the seating position approximately 75% of the time that it's in use anyway.

And everyone needs to remember to flush.

[Head Mutant]

I won't argue with the math, but with the seemingly disproportionate level of annoyance over this. No matter how much toilet is used with the seat down, it doesn't negate the facts that (1) it's really easy to lower the seat, and (2) it's not that big of a deal. I'm just trying to figure out why it seems to be a big deal to some.

[pfrsue]

Well, speaking as one who desired to use the commode in the middle of the night, thoughtfully left the lights out so as not to inadvertantly wake the spawn in the course of my travels, and took that infamous, terrifying and very nearly splashy plunge... I must ask the question: Since it's really easy to lower the seat and not that big of a deal, why not just lower it and save all the aggravation? SoM1 (the sole male in this household) would definitely back me up on this. He knows the meaning of the word aggravation, and how it applies to him.

[StarOpal]

Well, I have a gender neutral reason for putting down the the seat AND the lid:

Flushing without having the lid down spreads germs and such with the splashing water. You know, all over the bathroom. Where you brush your teeth. Walk around in your bare feet when you get out of the shower. The towels you dry your hands on. Shall I go on?

Of course you could flush and then put the seat back up just to make a point, but that wouldn't be very nice.

[Hucklebubba]

If I may interject and rob my own gender's side of ammo; a true pee marksman doesn't even need to raise the seat. In fact, I'm presently devising a method for going #1, cleanly, without even raising the lid.

Not much progress so far, but I remain hopeful.

[PoolMan]

It's not often I get to flash my credentials as a sensitive man, but here goes.

I always put everything, seat and lid, down after every use. Why? Because it's really easy, because I don't care at all, and because it avoids conflict. I moved it up, I can move it down.

[Big T]

I don't think that this actually does anything but subconsiously I just feel that closing both lids after any buissiness by any gender keeps things clean, unconfused about seat issues, and I think (for sure in outhouses) cuts down on the smell.

So yeah, that's me pretty much agrreing with Poolman and embelishing the reasons.

[TheLuckyOne]

poolman said:

It's not often I get to flash my credentials as a sensitive man, but here goes.

I always put everything, seat and lid, down after every use. Why? Because it's really easy, because I don't care at all, and because it avoids conflict. I moved it up, I can move it down.

And today we learn that PoolMan is, in fact, secretly PoolWoman.

I'll go on record as saying that I'm firmly in Justin's camp on this one. That said, I will usually put the seat down when I'm done, for the same reason I often hold doors open for women- it's the gentlemanly thing to do. But my doing that is a thoughtful gesture, not an obligation, and I think there'd be far less debate on the subject if women remembered to treat it that way. If we put the seat down, we were being nice and should be appreciated for it; if we happen to forget sometimes, well, that's why you walk into the bathroom with your eyes open and (if it's dark) remember to feel around the top of the toilet to see if the seat's up or down. If society's moving toward gender equality, that means there's no "right" way for the seat to be positioned.

Now, the toilet paper, on the other hand- there IS a right way to hang that, and it's called "underhand."

-D

[Head Mutant]

THANK you Drew. That's generally my attitude -- do it if I'm thinking about it, but if it slips my mind, oh well. Not a reason for a "talk".

Of course, PoolMan does give courses in toilet arrangement (week two: the blue cake), so perhaps we should attend his seminar. All hail his porcelain majesty!

[PoolMan]

admin said:

All hail his porcelain majesty!

Oh, I'm keeping that.

And Drew? Overhand.

[Head Mutant]

And guys? If you put new toilet paper on the thingie, it's a good week for you both.

[PoolMan]

Oh hell, changing the toilet paper seems to be the one thing I can't shame my wife (who is otherwise a domestic goddess) into doing. I'm ALWAYS nagging her on that one. It's quite weird. Unfamiliar territory.

[TheLuckyOne]

poolman said:

And Drew? Overhand.

Are you attempting to contradict the Simpsons? Because I'm not sure I can in good conscience associate with a man who would go against the Simpsons. It's simply not done... at least not by anyone other than my wife. Good day to you, sir.

-D

[TheLuckyOne]

poolman said:

Oh hell, changing the toilet paper seems to be the one thing I can't shame my wife (who is otherwise a domestic goddess) into doing. I'm ALWAYS nagging her on that one. It's quite weird. Unfamiliar territory.

It's weird what gets through, isn't it? My wife is the most organized, neurotic, everything-in-its-place person you've met outside of an OCD ward in all respects except one... she has never, ever, not once in her entire life refilled the ice cube trays. If I forget to take out the trash or put away laundry, she'll hound me until I do; but whether she used the last of the ice or not, if I don't refill the trays, you're not getting a cold drink in our house, period. It's uncanny.

-D