Spider-Man 3

[Al]

You're right, Sandman does seem a bit arbitrary. But, at the same time, they really needed a way to tear Peter's life apart. Without that, you only have a couple of options:

a) Peter is happy throughout the whole movie, which just wouldn't be very Spider-Mannish.

b) You could move the symbiote onto center stage and give goofy evil Peter a larger block of screen time, which would really kill the appeal of the character. As fun as that is to watch, I think they were wise to minimalize that that part of the movie in the way they did.

c) Also put the symbiote at center stage but do angry evil Peter, which is also just a bad idea. Too much pacing and shouting and being a righteous jerk is no way to win over audience. You'd also probably be toeing the line of the all-important PG-13.

d) All Harry, all the time. As much as I wish the Harry/Peter relationship in sm3 could have been opened up a bit (a few more mindgames would have been neat before Harry tipped his hat), I really think that the first two movies said just about all there is to say. There wasn't too much more other than the final step of strapping on dad's glider. Putting too much focus on simmering tensions and the whole 'mental chess' thing is going to bore a good portion of your paying fans.

Also a good reason for the Sandman: he looked pretty flippin' sweet.

[aargmematey]

I don't know, I think that
a) His problems with MJ would have provided the needed level of angst for him. Also there's...
b) The fact that his once best friend now doesn't just want Spider-man dead, but also wants Peter Parker dead as well.
c) Eddie Brock trying to snag his job away from him...and then actually doing it?

And those are only the story elements kept from the actual movie. I'm sure if Sandman were cut they could have come up with loads of ways the world could poo on Spidey, without messing up the continuity of the first film (and screwing with our heads).

[PoolMan]

The one thing I'd like to say (rather than pick at bits) is that the trend of the Spidey movies getting less and less fun continued here.

SPOILERS!

In the first one, you couldn't take the smile off my face if you tried. Peter gets his powers and goes whooping with delight over rooftops before clumsily slamming himself into a wall. He is inexperienced, but he's having a great time.

In the second one, he starts dealing with darker aspects of his role. The life of the hero gets to him, he loses his powers, his girl goes off to get married to another guy... it all gets very down.

In the third one, it's even worse! He regains Harry as a friend, only to have him die. He inadvertantly kills Eddie when he destroys the symbiote. The whole "Ben's other killer" thing. It all ends on such a downer.

Spider Man to me is about a wisecracking, suddenly confident kid who becomes a hero. There's room for the trials and tribulations that fill his life, but where's all the fun? The humour?

[Head Mutant]

Seriously? I was laughing a *lot* during it, darkness and all. Peter's evil geek walk, Bruce Campbell's cameo, "Chump!", the way Spidey takes down the New Goblin the first time... I didn't find this movie a downer at all. Darker, sure. But it's almost always a trend of sequels to take the heroes down a notch in order to build them back up (see: Empire Strikes Back, et al). And comic books are notorious for thinking up new and nefarious ways to bring their heroes to the brink of utter despair.

From reading this forum thread and talking with a lot of people, I've come to the conclusion that Spidey 3 is far more polarizing than the first two — people either liked it, although admitting its flaws, or really didn't care for it, while still admitting that there's some good parts. Of course there are the fanboy geeks who can see no wrong, and the folk who just plain don't like these types of movies. It also had to grapple with a giant's share of expectations from the established fan base, which can be crippling to many franchises.

I'd rate the series as 2, 3 and then 1 as the order of my favorite to least. And I *loved* the first one. The second was far more polished, and the third just felt like much more of a comic book world that fit.

[PoolMan]

I did laugh at points (though not always when Raimi intended, I'm sure). Bruce Campbell was awesome. The "where do these guys come from?" line was a great poke at comic book villains always springing up (moreso in movies). Almost everything with JJJ was great (the camera bit with the little girl was a little forced).

But the overall story arc ends on this huge downer. Lots of dead characters (a necessity when half of NYC has seen Spidey without his mask). And another "woe is me, I'm a hero with awesome abilities" theme, similar to what Justin complained about in the X Men series.

I didn't hate SM3. I could be clearer about that. But there was just this huge, gaping hole in Spidey's personality (his quipping sense of humour and fun) that only seemed to poke up here and there, and would then go off and hide while Tobey Maguire cried AGAIN.