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Post by Hucklebubba on Nov 30, 2005 1:32:38 GMT -5
A thought occured to me the other day while I was watching The O'Reilly Factor (hold the jokes please). A certain bit of e-mail during the Talking Points segment said something a little like this:
"First Christians complain that Christmas is becoming too commercialized, then they complain that it's being taken out of the stores. There's just no pleasing you people."
The proper reaction, altered according to who you are, is to say "Hey, wow, we/they really are stupid!" have a good chuckle, and move on.
But I think this guy or gal makes a good point, and brings to light an issue that must be resolved post-haste. It goes without saying that I wouldn't have brought it up if I didn't believe I had the perfect answer.
First step--and if you are taken aback by this, just alight gracefully on your fainting couch until the shock passes--remove Christmas from the stores entirely.
Second step: Expunge all commercial elements from Dec. 25, limiting it exclusively to traditional Christmasy-type stuff. I should issue a caveat here, and mention that by "traditional" I'm referring to baby Jesus and co., and not to the original phallus-worshipping pagan holiday.
Final step: Fill the newly-created economic void by designating November as National Consumer Feeding Frenzy Month, culminating in Super Best Open Presents Day on the 30th. Thanksgiving and Black Friday get to stay where they are. Santa Claus could be revamped into a pilgrim or something.
Whammo. Everybody's happy.
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Post by DocD83 on Nov 30, 2005 7:41:20 GMT -5
Except for the people who were upset about Christmas being sleighted by Target and Wal-Mart while other holidays were recognized, who were the ones who brought this up in the first place.
I'd say the proper reation is to say, "Wow, that guy who got on the air is too stupid to realize that the people making the ruckus are just a handfull of people out of the 200 million Christians in the country!" have a good chuckle, and move on.
Edited to add: It just struck me you might have been going for sarcastic with that post. It's too early in the day.....
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Post by Magill on Nov 30, 2005 8:59:47 GMT -5
Except for the people who were upset about Christmas being sleighted by Target and Wal-Mart while other holidays were recognized, who were the ones who brought this up in the first place. Can you give me more details? Last time I checked, you could buy Christmas trees, Christmas tree decorations, Christmas non-tree decorations, nativities, Christmas cards, Christmas wrapping paper, and many other Christmasy gifts at those stores. Not to mention all sorts of stuff for Easter, which is really supposed to be the numero uno Christian holiday. Is it just that they don't say "Merry Christmas"? In my book, that's a really small issue. I think "Happy Holidays" or "Season's Greetings" are perfectly festive while including other non-Christian holidays that are celebrated around the time. edited to add, like Doc, I posted this before coffee. I realize that Doc, you're not one of the people who's upset. It also might be that I read this article yesterday and I think that my eyes have only recently recovered from all of their eye-rolling induced strain |
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Post by Genetic Mishap on Nov 30, 2005 10:05:21 GMT -5
I agree totally with Hucklebubba...EXCEPT that I'd rather have the phallus worship instead.
Seriously, though, people who say "The phrase 'Happy Holidays' persecutes Christians!" just baffle me. You're given the same treatment as everyone else; that's persecution? I am baffled to the point that I was inspired to both verbally punt such a guy in the paper's opinion section, and to make a cheap offensive bumper sticker about it.
Which is available for you to print on your own bumper sticker paper, but I doubt I could post it here.
As an aside to the original Xmas thing, I've heard of those who've tried to revamp Xmas entirley by getting rid of the pagan elements altogether. For example, they'd put their presents in a manger instead of under a tree.
Now, back to sleep!
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Post by Hucklebubba on Nov 30, 2005 11:15:28 GMT -5
Edited to add: It just struck me you might have been going for sarcastic with that post. It's too early in the day..... You are correct, sir. The quote was meant to be facetious, however, the rest of the post falls under the heading of "Kind of serious about/quasi-good idea that will never happen." I mainly just want for there to be a holiday called "Super Best Open Presents Day." Seriously, though, people who say "The phrase 'Happy Holidays' persecutes Christians!" just baffle me. Oh, come now. No one has said those words exactly, have they? Really? Please say no. The phrase "Happy Holidays" doesn't illicit any feelings of persecution on my part, but it does cause temporary immobilization, and also exposes the flashing orange orb on my forehead, thus leaving me briefly open to attack. |
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Post by Magill on Nov 30, 2005 12:22:21 GMT -5
Seriously, though, people who say "The phrase 'Happy Holidays' persecutes Christians!" just baffle me. Oh, come now. No one has said those words exactly, have they? Really? Please say no. The phrase "Happy Holidays" doesn't illicit any feelings of persecution on my part, but it does cause temporary immobilization, and also exposes the flashing orange orb on my forehead, thus leaving me briefly open to attack. It's not saying that exact thing, but in the letters to the editor of my local paper, someone had this to say |
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Post by PoolMan on Nov 30, 2005 12:52:08 GMT -5
I realize there are a lot of devout Christians on this board, but you strike me as the kind of people who DON'T go off the deep end over stupid things. So take this with a grain of salt, this isn't aimed at you, but at the people who frustrate me so.
The marketing position of a store saying "Happy Holidays" instead of "Merry Christmas" is not persecution. It's acknowledgement that hey, there's more than one faith on the face of this planet. The fact that the malls are all done up in pine branches and red and green is plainly a celebration of Christmas (albeit with the pagan trappings). I don't think it's so terrible to want to wish Hebrews and Muslims and everybody else a nice winter holiday season too.
People make such a big deal about this, and I honestly can't understand why.
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Post by bladestarr on Nov 30, 2005 12:54:35 GMT -5
Don't the Japanese already celebrate this? Yes, I think it's 2 weeks after Super Dragon Happy Lucky Mecha Schoolgirl Celebration Day. ;D
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Post by DocD83 on Nov 30, 2005 16:01:17 GMT -5
According to the article I read, the group complaining was upset that Wal-Mart had a specific webpage for Chaunnukah (sp?) and Kwanzaa items, but that searching for "Christmas" would yield a generic holiday welcome page. Combined with the (recent) switch to "Happy Holidays" or whatever, it just looked really bad. Wal-Mart supposedly altered the website inconsistency but kept the generic greeting and both sides called it a day.
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Post by Genetic Mishap on Nov 30, 2005 17:24:07 GMT -5
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Post by Spiderdancer on Nov 30, 2005 17:54:36 GMT -5
Personally, I am a Christian of the type which could be called "devout" or could be called "fundamentalist psycho" depending on whom you ask. And I personally love the fact that I live in a free, democratic, and capitalist nation where, if people convert to my religion, it's because they believe rather than because the other alternatives involve torture and/or death.
So I am all in favor of retailers calling the holiday whatever they want, because they are doing it to get more money from the largest spectrum of customers possible. As my Mom would say, "If it works, more power to 'em." If everyone (including the peon employees at my local Stuff Mart) gets richer because stores have jettisoned a True Meaning of Christmas that has meaning for only a tiny segment of the population, so be it. Why should I care? There are no nail prints in the hands of Santa Claus, nor the FAO Schwarz bear the last time I checked.
It does frequently annoy me that the undereducated oververbal Christians are the ones who get air time, though. My own denomination, the Assemblies of God, has given very large amounts of money to hurricane relief. Are you going to hear this on the news? Of course not. You're going to hear about the wack jobs who think the hurricane was God's judgment on sinful New Orleans. (And I wonder what they were doing in that town in Mississippi that got wiped off the map? Child-murdering baby cow molesters, perhaps?)
Rational and compassionate Christians do not make for good news, any more than egalitarian and intellectual Muslims do.
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Post by Head Mutant on Dec 1, 2005 8:15:37 GMT -5
Cursed cow molesters...
I concur with Pooly and most of you; it's pretty much of a non-issue. As long as people don't get offended if I wish them a "Merry Christmas", I'm not offended in return if they say "Happy Holidays" or "Have a krazy Kwanzaa" or whatever. (also, a "tip top Tet".)
Food for thought: some Christian denominations (such as my brother's) don't even celebrate Christmas as a religious holiday -- not because they've given into the commercial holiday, but because they don't recognize Christmas as an official holiday put forth by the Bible. Which it isn't. It's good to remember stuff, and I'm all for fun holidays where anyone can celebrate anything they want (except, of course, cow molesting), but people need to lay off getting riled up over small, petty stuff and turn their focus to where it's needed.
Holidays are for rememberance and for celebration. If you want to participate in either, fine; if not, fine.
As my mum said, you gotta pick and choose your battles. Not everything can or should be your fight -- otherwise, you become a crazy person.
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Post by DocD83 on Dec 1, 2005 8:51:21 GMT -5
The sad thing is, a surprising number of people do get offended by any mention of Christmas or Christianity, or any appearance of their symbols or that of their groups, that they didnt personally go out and ask for.
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