the OFFICIAL comic books discussion thread!!!

[DTH]

theluckyone said:

Joss has a great ear for dialogue and a love of classic Claremont stories that makes him a good choice to write the X-Men... hell, Buffy and Willow are just what you'd get if you split Kitty Pryde into two people.

I am not that familiar with Kitty Pryde. All I really know is that Jubilee was Kitty Pryde v2.0 (I realise that's a massive generalisation as she's been an important X-person for years).

He generally writes Claremontian stories with an updated sense of style and dialogue, which is refreshing and works well for a newer generation. His first arc on Astonishing fell into the trap of decompression, begun by Bendis and now the established style for Marvel (space it out over 6 issues, that way it'll fit neatly into a trade paperback!), and it dragged in places, but it was fun and generally satisfying.

The TPB market is an important one nowadays and I think it is more the comic houses that are requiring writers to cater for this market. Everything is 6 issue mini's nowadays and I don't think Whedon/Bendis et al can be blamed for market forces.

His second arc, just completed, was less so... still good dialogue, but it required massive revision of extablished characterization, featured a so-so, rather uninspired villain, and may (unless things are not what they seem, which is quite possible) have trampled all over another writer's recently extablished story.

That's a bit lame of Whedon. He sounds a little bit like Jeph Loeb in that he mostly has all the elements of making a good writer but he's got his "comfort zone" and won't deviate from it, even if that means running roughshod over existing characters.

Jeph Loeb (responsible for a lot of comic writing over the years, movies and Smallville) tells a good story but he doesn't give one iota for continuity or sanctity. Hell, this is the man who has had Lex Luthor shooting up with kryptonite-laced venom (a combat drug used by Batman villain, Bane) and then donning a powersuit to go fight Superman hand to hand.

That's Lex Luthor: U.S. President, the most intelligent man in the DC Universe who has spent 50+ years of continuity manipulating people to fight Superman who, for the sake of the story and a "cool ending", flies round in some power armour.

That's pretty much sacrilige as far as continuity and charactersation go. How close to this is Whedon?

Tangent Warning: I've got a lot of love for Joss Whedon. I love Buffy/Angel and honestly that I've let down fans of Firefly by not getting involved from ground zero. You see, I'm indicative of a lot of Whedon-fans who just didn't buy in to Firefly for no real reason. I wish I could give you one, but I didn't watch it, along with a lot of people, and consequently, it faltered.

Serenity taught me a harsh lesson.

Now, my turn: the new X-Factor book, starring Madrox the Multiple Man and written by the hilarious, immensely talented Peter David, launches in November. Longshot will be joining the Exiles early next year. Greatest next few months ever? Discuss.

Longshot has always been a favourite of mine ever since his appearance in the mojoverse in X-Men. He's an interesting character and very charismatic.

Exiles is getting a LOT of love from people at the moment and I'm interested in hearing more. Getting Longshot involved seems like a great move.

Who is in X-Factor? Is Havok still in there?

I don't really follow 616 continuity any more. Well, save from some limited exposure to JMS' run on Spider-man.

[TheLuckyOne]

dth said:

Who is in X-Factor? Is Havok still in there?

No, Havok is leading one of the X-Men teams right now. The upcoming X-Factor spins out of Peter David's recent MadroX mini, which I highly recommend... great primer for the character and a good story to boot. The original X-Factor, as you probably know, was a government-sponsored superteam (well, not originally, but at the time everyone remembers, from the early 90's when Peter David took over), but the new X-Factor is a detective agency Jamie Madrox set up in Mutant Town, a ghetto of New York. The team is supposed to consist of Madrox, Wolfsbane, Strong Guy, M, Rictor, Siryn, and a mystery character who's almost certainly Layla Miller, apparently from House of M.

As for your earlier comments on Claremont, I hear you... different strokes. If you do love Whedon, though, it might be worth investigating one of his biggest influences, which you can do pretty easily with the mega-cheap (but black and white) Essential X-Men reprint volumes. As for Claremont/Lee in '91, Claremont actually left before Lee did... Claremont's last issue was X-Men #3, I think Lee stuck around until #11 or so.


-D

[DTH]

theluckyone said:

the new X-Factor is a detective agency Jamie Madrox set up in Mutant Town, a ghetto of New York. The team is supposed to consist of Madrox, Wolfsbane, Strong Guy, M, Rictor, Siryn, and a mystery character who's almost certainly Layla Miller, apparently from House of M.

Fair enough. Mutant Town is "District X", no? I have the first TPB (and have reviewed this). I remember when X-Factor was just the X-Men with a different name (and mandate) pretending to be an anti-mutant agency and then became another group (the government sponsored team, you mentioned).

I'm gonna appropriate Madrox and then check out the X-Factor relaunch. Perhaps this new version will be the originality I was seeking in District X?

As for your earlier comments on Claremont, I hear you... different strokes. If you do love Whedon, though, it might be worth investigating one of his biggest influences, which you can do pretty easily with the mega-cheap (but black and white) Essential X-Men reprint volumes.

I might just do that! Budget allowing.

I'm definitely interested in picking up Age of Apocalypse (the first one), which is getting a reprint in TPB form.

As for Claremont/Lee in '91, Claremont actually left before Lee did... Claremont's last issue was X-Men #3, I think Lee stuck around until #11 or so.

LOL fair enough. No wonder the stories went down hill... and radically fell out of continuity.

[Spiderdancer]

Hey everyone! Sorry to break in! I just finished reading Spectacular Spider-man Vol. 3. I thought the first part was okay, though I was rooting for Connors (eye heart lizards, what can I say), but then I got to issue #14 and it blew me away.

I've NEVER seen comic art as beautiful as Paolo Rivera's paintings, and the story almost made me cry. And I NEVER cry. ESPECIALLY not while reading comic books. For an example, see my reaction to Hank's death in Ultimate X-men: New Mutants. It went like this: Ha ha ha HAAAAA. And ditto Warren Worthington's "porn star" look in UXM #10 and the fact that he has EXACTLY the same apparently xeroxed facial expression in several panels. Don't even get me started on Storm's "Halle Berry Catwoman homage" outfit.

But I digress. Does anyone know anything else Paolo Rivera has done? I want.

And now back to your regularly scheduled forum thread.

[sandieman27]

This may be off topic but Harry Potter Rules!!!

[TheLuckyOne]

sandieman27 said:

This may be off topic but Harry Potter Rules!!!

In some threads, it would be very on topic indeed... for instance, the two threads devoted to the latest HP book. In the comic book discussion thread, however? Yes, just a bit off topic.

-D

[Head Mutant]

But... but... he rules!

[Spiderdancer]

I've just read Wolverine: Coyote Crossing. I'm interested to note how much better he is when he's on his own than when involved in the X-men.

For one thing, the whole "don't kill" rule pretty much makes a person useless when that person's main asset is a set of indestructible claws. The whole modus operandi is much more effective against thugs with guns than against, oh, flying telepaths or metalkinetics.

And of course there's the fact that "Wolverine" titles can represent him as sort of a short, ugly guy, instead of a vaguely-Inuit-looking supermodel (see Ultimate X-anything). I mean, I have nothing against Inuits, and I know continuity is a laughable concept as regards comics anyway. But if Origins can be believed, he started life looking like Little Lord Fauntleroy. At what point did he morph from "pale roundeye with pointy nose" to "almond eyes, wide cheekbones and cute flattish nose"?

And nose breakage can't be a factor, 'cause I've seen multiply broken noses, and they look nothing like his.

[TheOogieBoogieMan]

Ok, I finished reading the second tpb of Preacher (Until the End of the World) the other day.

The worst thing I can say about it is that it had to end. Seriously.

I don't even know where to begin in describing its greatness. The back story with Jesse's family is just so...good. Seriously, I can't think of any other way to put it. The whole thing is just really REALLY good. Then again, it could just be that I lack communication skills, but the book is still excellent. Probably moreso than the first tpb.

And I am almost halfway through the first Cerebus tpb. That book I can describe. The issues get better as they go along, and there are some funny moments, but so far, the thing is merely average. You can, however, see the potential of the character, and apparently, the second tpb is when the series takes an upshoot, so I'll buy and read the second volume regardless of how the rest of this one turns out.

[TheLuckyOne]

Hey, glad you enjoyed it, oogie! Yeah, it was definitely a great story... I think I might enjoy Gone to Texas just a bit more in retrospect, but they're both terrific, no question. And the good news is, you've got great stuff ahead of you, too- Proud Americans is really strong as well, and Ancient History... man. Some folks might not like AH because it's a detour from the main storyline, but the Saint of Killers miniseries is so strong- Ellis just gets the western, every element of it that makes it powerful, makes us love it. Grand stuff.

Not quite as enamored of books 5, 7, and to some extent 8 -- not bad, just not (to my mind) as strong as what's come before -- but he really brought it all together in a powerful way for the finale. Have fun, let me know what you think of Proud Americans when you do manage to get it.


"Not enough gun."
~Saint of Killers, War in the Sun

-D

[DTH]

To re-iterate:

Anything published by Vertigo is da bomb.

[DTH]

Has anyone been following current Marvel continuity at all? (I'm talking Avengers Disassembled, New Avengers, Astonishing X-Men, Sentry, House of M, DeciMation, X-Men: 198).

I got some things to discuss but not really much point if I'm the only with a hint of a clue of what's going on

[Spiderdancer]

Not me! The reason my posts to this thread are so random is that I'm both cheap and poor, so I refuse to pay money for comics. What happens is I wait until my library gets the full hardbound set of a given whatever, then I read it all at once.

Besides, I'm fairly sure "continuity" is an entirely spurious concept as regards comic books. I gave up trying to keep track of who is alive, dead, having a sex change, et cetera, given that different titles of the same hero don't always agree on this.

[TheLuckyOne]

dth said:

Has anyone been following current Marvel continuity at all? (I'm talking Avengers Disassembled, New Avengers, Astonishing X-Men, Sentry, House of M, DeciMation, X-Men: 198).

Very much so. I avoided House of M on general principle, but I'm fairly well abreast (teehee!) of what's going on in everything. What did you want to discuss? Where all the mutants went?

-D

[Al]

I'm poor, too, so I've really only read the House of M main storyline. I'm relying on rumors and hearsay to fill in all the rest of the gaps.

Al