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Post by TheLuckyOne on Oct 10, 2008 0:07:19 GMT -5
Well, I guess the promos for next week's episode put paid to my notion that Mama Petrelli was lying to Sylar (and any theory that maybe Nathan was adopted). Sylar's definitely her son, it seems. And not even Peter's half-brother, they're full brothers, at least if the promo is to be believed.
So the question is, at this point, can Papa Petrelli possibly live up to the hype that's been built up around him? Leader of the villains, supposedly dead, father of the two most powerful characters on the show... that's quite a pedigree. This is the guy who kept Mama Petrelli and Linderman under his thumb for years?
-D
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Post by TheLuckyOne on Oct 14, 2008 9:54:22 GMT -5
Hey, can someone remind me who I'm supposed to be rooting for again? I keep forgetting.
Let's be serious for a second. I understand that they're trying to instill a moral gray area and remind us that people don't break down into clearly delineated "good" and "evil" camps in real life. I get that, and it makes sense. But maybe the writers could use a reminder that there's a difference between some moral compromises and having every character switch between wonderfully good and abominably evil actions every single episode. In this episode alone, we have Peter trying to kill his mother, Hiro killing Ando (of course he'll save him later, but still), and Mohinder killing/eating his neighbor, a drug dealer, and Maya. Yeah, no one will miss any of those three, but it's the principle of the thing. Those are arguably our three most heroic characters, all now murderers or attempted murderers.
You know what was great? When HRG was our morally ambiguous character, a guy who tried to serve the greater good, but you knew he'd done horrible things and sold his soul years ago in the pursuit of it. He's a fantastic character, but I don't want every character to be him. I honestly think the writers need to step back and seriously evaluate the difference between "Peter has to take part in a robbery to learn information about who he is" from season 2, and "Peter tries to kill his mom." The former is relatively easy to justify, but it's damn hard to come back from the latter. Basically, either let some of the heroes be heroic, or don't spend time building up likeable characters if you're just going to make us hate them.
Tune in next week, when Monica kicks stroke victims in the balls and Micah puts a puppy in a blender.
-D
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Post by StarOpal on Oct 14, 2008 10:46:30 GMT -5
Yeah, I don't really know how I feel about the way it seems to be going so far. I hope Papa Petrelli is one bad dude and lives up to the all the characters shaking in their boots. It would give the show some focus.
I mean, it's a bit whiplash inducing to go from Hiro and Ando's "We are so bad ass." to Hiro's being all stabby. But yeah, Ando is so not dead.
Oh, and I hope they explain how Maury escaped his mental prison. (or did I forget that from last season, or is that something in the comics?)
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Post by Lissa on Oct 14, 2008 14:24:25 GMT -5
Yeah, the Hiro/Ando thing only makes sense if Hiro's got a plan. Otherwise, "hey, you random people, you want me to stab my best friend based on two minutes of arguing? Sure!"
And I think it's getting more and more painfully obvious that Hiro is going to be the "villain" in that flashforward. And dude? If you don't want your best friend to fight you, you might not want to stab him.
Clare, honey, stop reading comic books. Fighting crime in four inch heels is REALLY not the best idea. Invest in some good trainers, and wear your hair up.
Daphne looks so much cuter with her short choppy haircut than her Matt's-wife-haircut.
You know, for two seasons I used to adore Mohinder. I mean, he's a science pretty boy type that's not allowed to have nice things- those guys are serious crack to me. And last night, I was totally rooting for Maya to kill him off because he's gotten so annoying.
When you're rooting for Maya to kill off Mohinder, something is wrong.
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wdm0744
Boomstick Coordinator
"It's all in the reflexes."
Posts: 171
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Post by wdm0744 on Oct 14, 2008 14:51:35 GMT -5
Can someone help me out? "Lost" I can keep up with, but "Heroes" is starting to confuse the hell out of me.
First of all, I haven't missed an episode, but since when did we all start calling "Cheerleader's Dad", aka, Mr. Bennett, "HRG"? They even said that name in the "previously on Heroes" bit. What does "HRG" mean? Was this introduced in the comics or something?
Secondly, I feel like I must have missed something last night. How did Hiro go from calling Daphne "nemesis" to wanting to join up with her so bad that he is willing to, at least temporarily, kill Ando? How did he learn or come to believe that she would help him to get the formula back when just a couple episodes ago, he was convinced that she was trying to sell it?
And for that matter, can someone remind me where we are on the whole formula thing? Is it still in two pieces, or did Daphne give the whole thing to Linderman (aka, Parkman's dad)?
All the jumping around is really doing a number on me.
Third, is there any indication that the timeline from season 2, in which Peter's Irish girlfriend was lost in the dystopian future, will ever be resolved?
Can someone set me straight?
Meanwhile, I completely agree with you, Drew. It's tough to like any of the characters on the show anymore. Not that I am going to give up on it anytime soon, or anything, I would just like a little balance. And some clarity. Claire, in particular, is beginning to piss me off.
For instance, why in the world would she get so upset with her father for wanting the "vortex guy" to destroy Sylar? I mean, doesn't she like eternally hate Sylar for terrorizing her and picking at her brain? Wouldn't a reasonable person see the unique oppurtunity presented to eternally banish an invincible, walking menace to society? I get that she is all peeved at her dad for being Jack Bauer and trying to use "vortex guy", but come on people.
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Post by StarOpal on Oct 14, 2008 15:48:15 GMT -5
Can someone help me out? "Lost" I can keep up with, but "Heroes" is starting to confuse the hell out of me. First of all, I haven't missed an episode, but since when did we all start calling "Cheerleader's Dad", aka, Mr. Bennett, "HRG"? They even said that name in the "previously on Heroes" bit. What does "HRG" mean? Was this introduced in the comics or something? HRG=Horn Rimmed Glasses. It started way back in season 1, before we knew Mr. Bennett was Mr. Bennett. I'm thinking it was a fan thing, that ended up in the comics. Totally an infiltration plan. Linderman/Maury have it. Not at this time. Try again later. I think that's what they were going for. Her and Vortex had their moment and she was all attached, and HRG tries to turn him into an cold-blooded killer when all he had left was the fact that he'd only killed someone by mistake. |
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wdm0744
Boomstick Coordinator
"It's all in the reflexes."
Posts: 171
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Post by wdm0744 on Oct 14, 2008 16:19:16 GMT -5
Thanks, Eunice. I probably should have figured out "HRG", but I have just always called him "Cheerleader's Dad".
I get where they're coming from on the Claire thing, I really do, I just think it's getting a little illogical. But, maybe that's just me.
As for the Hiro inflitration thing - I'll buy that, but was there anything in the episode leading up to the stabbing moment that led us to this conclusion, or are we just trusting in Hiro's goodness and what we know of the character?
For that matter, how did Daphne and Knox find Hiro and Ando in the first place? It seemed like they arranged a meeting. When did that happen?
I don't remember blacking out last night. I feel like Mulder would tell me I "lost time". I swear I sat and watched the whole episode, but it just seemed more disjointed than usual.
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Post by TheLuckyOne on Oct 14, 2008 16:22:59 GMT -5
Clare, honey, stop reading comic books. Fighting crime in four inch heels is REALLY not the best idea. Invest in some good trainers, and wear your hair up. What? You're saying 4-inch stilettos, miniskirts, and volleyball-sized breasts spilling out of a midriff baring v-neck are not the ideal outfit for fighting crime? Stupid lying comic books. First of all, I haven't missed an episode, but since when did we all start calling "Cheerleader's Dad", aka, Mr. Bennett, "HRG"? They even said that name in the "previously on Heroes" bit. What does "HRG" mean? Was this introduced in the comics or something? It stands for "horn-rimmed glasses." Back in the first season, before Bennet's name was known, fans took to calling him "HRG," kind of like Cancer Man/Cigarette Smoking Man from The X-Files. Even when we learned his actual name, the nickname stuck. Third, is there any indication that the timeline from season 2, in which Peter's Irish girlfriend was lost in the dystopian future, will ever be resolved? I wondered the same thing for a long time. But recently I read an interview where several writers said that Peter's attempts to retrieve Caitlin would have occurred in the second half of season 2, but now they're not sure that they're going to revisit it. They seem to be making a real effort to sweep as much of season 2 under the table as possible, hence no West (yay) or Monica (boo). Although apparently Monica may be in some of season 3's deleted scenes. -D |
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wdm0744
Boomstick Coordinator
"It's all in the reflexes."
Posts: 171
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Post by wdm0744 on Oct 14, 2008 16:40:48 GMT -5
Right on, Drew. Thanks for informing me.
No West? Alright! While watching Season 2, I kept wishing he would turn out to be a villian since I really didn't like the idea that they were trying to pass off his creepy stalker-vibe as charming, harmless flirting.
No Monica on the other hand, is very dissappointing. I really liked her character, and I thought she had the best ability. I could have done without the accent, though. Southern accents in movies and tv are most often anything but subtle or realistic.
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Post by Storm_Rider on Oct 14, 2008 20:49:08 GMT -5
Warning: Yet another long-ass rant.
To add a bit to the "plague future" issue, well they've pretty much avoided that one by replacing it with "destruction of the whole world future", so Peter's Irish girlfriend got the quickest off-screen death probably in history: she just stopped existing.
Yes the writers do want to kinda forget about season 2 since all of their plans for it went up in smoke with the strike, Maya's power was supposed to be able to absorb the plague and whatnot;, as far as I'm concerned nothing from the second season has an important impact from now on, except for the character development that took place meaning Hiro and Adam mostly, cause Peter has been so busy he effectively forgot about his love interest, and the relationship between Bob and Elle is now moot, so yeah, more or less a fresh start with chapter 3.
So the plot thickens while paradoxically thinning, we finally have our villain mastermind and explanation for Linderman, while at the same time we have these big-ass upheavals in character development. Let's take them one by one:
Let's start with Mohinder...frankly I think they want to kill him by the end of the season, or turn him into a Doctor Doom-like villain for the next chapter. He is becoming such a pain to watch and listen to, counter-intuitively Maya seems to be among the few character who are still on the Good side of the isle. And considering I've been wishing for her to disappear into oblivion until now, I have the strange suspicion that she may still be very important in things to come - arguably she might be able to subdue everybody with her power, kinda like the opposite of the "neutralizing" mutant from the X-Men, or the Haitian in this case, the difference being that as far as we've seen, her killing range can be quite larger than the Haitian neutralizing range. Have any of you wondered where all the goo is coming from? yuck
Hiro and Ando, damn...it, that's why you get zapped Hiro, mental note: "don't stab loyal friends". For the record, I'm sure Ando isn't dead, just because we didn't see it, it doesn't mean Hiro didn't stop time and prepared an elaborate charade, and considering Daphne's reaction to Knox's request, and the fact that Hiro can't freeze her, she would have gone along with it.
Poor Peter, after two seasons of trying desperately to be the good guy, he is degraded by the writers in this "rite of passage" that probably a lot of superheroes consider at least once or are inclined to go with, giving way to their more primal urges of using their powers without regards to consequences. I think it all comes from his "hunger" (and now every time I think about that I think about Marvel Zombies - damn you comic books!!), it's a new and as far as we've seen powerful impulse and he will have to learn to control or probably give into it and become Heroes' version of Apocalypse. But I dunno, the writers would show some massive cojones to turn one of the most obvious "good" characters from past seasons into a villain, I hope he gets a handle on his addiction, as we've seen in the future from Gabriel, it can be done.
HRG, great - great character, his humanity is the thing that makes him do bad things for the greater good and probably makes him unaware of Sylar's efforts to change, and clouds his judgment due to what Syler did to Claire. People need to start talking more frankly to each other or we've seen what the future holds for them.
Now, Sylar is becoming a nuanced character in the footsteps of HRG, I doubt he is really trying to change his murderous ways, yet I do think that he wants the ability to control his hunger, but only for his own unknown reasons. I also think that he genuinely shows signs of regret or remorse at what he did to Claire, but this has nothing to do with his wish to control his hunger.
Looking a bit to the future, I don't see how they can prevent the future unless somehow, Peter and Sylar get to some common ground, maybe through their blood relation, and start working together, cause let's face it Peter and Sylar on the same team would be quite the sight to see.
Anyway I read an interview with the the creator of Heroes, and apparently the second part of this season, Chapter 4 will be called Fugitives, which only leaves me to continue my X-Men analogy and speculate on a possible sort of mutant registration law here. Any thoughts?
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Post by PoolMan on Oct 15, 2008 14:50:32 GMT -5
Yeah, I don't really know how I feel about the way it seems to be going so far. I hope Papa Petrelli is one bad dude and lives up to the all the characters shaking in their boots. It would give the show some focus. Agreed, but thankfully it looks like this is exactly where things are going. After all, somehow it seems that just by appearing in Mama P's dream, he somehow paralyzes her. Is that Papa P in the future doing that? Or Papa P on the bed? I also found his comment about Mama's ability to see the future as a problem interesting... maybe the writers are finally going to angle towards reeling in all these characters with time travel or future sight. Other than that, I agree with most of what's been said of this week's episode... confusing, and our Heroes are suddenly all acting like dicks. I did really like how Clare relented when she realized vortex guy wasn't the killer she thought he was. I also like the fact that she's not only conflicted about her perceived mission, but that she's suddenly got serious reason to doubt her father. HRG is now running around (unwillingly) with Sylar, will order a murder when it suits him, and shows a willingness to lock up the innocent without a trial. Suddenly all those tender hugs aren't going to fix everything, Noah. I also quite enjoyed the quick glimpse we get of Sylar as he instills this doubt into Clare at the end. We get a quick shot of that smug grin that shows he's the only one who sees how this is really working... which means he can probably see where the conflict between the Bennetts comes to a head. The Ando stabbing is just silly. Even if Hiro did what he said, why the heck would Knox buy it at all? If I said "to prove yourself, you've got to kill your best friend" to someone and they did it, I'd probably be freaked out, not satisfied. This is someone you want with you? But more than anything, I don't like the villification of Peter. Peter's always been that beacon of hope character for me, the one you know you can believe in. Conflict him, sure, but going to the point of trying to kill his mother in the space of a single episode is a little much. Me no likey. Interesting that (aside from Maya) Mohinder seems to be targetting lowlifes to satisfy whatever urge is driving him right now. First the wifebeater, then the drug dealer. He may be going off his rocker, but it looks like for the moment he's at least trying to remain a good guy. |
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Post by TheLuckyOne on Oct 20, 2008 21:52:53 GMT -5
High five, turtle.
-D
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Post by StarOpal on Oct 20, 2008 22:30:05 GMT -5
You beat me to it! My favorite line of the season. Even though we all saw the fake death plan coming a mile away, I like that Ando and Hiro have made up. Also, how cool is "Mr. African-san," huh? I liked that the Puppetmaster (that's what I call him anyway) and Papa Petrelli came off as so evil in this episode. Character exploration is fine and good, but I've missed a really good bad guy in this show. Mr. 'I use your fear' doesn't count, he has neither flare nor the right kind of "ew" factor. Mohinder? *eye roll* But does this mean Maya's dead? Hope lives on. So, Drew and Poolman, how do you feel about Peter, apparently at least, losing his powers? Discuss. This should stop his whole the hunger... THE HUNGER! thing. Didn't suit him, kinda came off as whiny (to me at least). |
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Post by TheLuckyOne on Oct 21, 2008 8:24:39 GMT -5
So, Drew and Poolman, how do you feel about Peter, apparently at least, losing his powers? Discuss. This should stop his whole the hunger... THE HUNGER! thing. Didn't suit him, kinda came off as whiny (to me at least). I'm so over Peter right now... I don't know, he used to be my favorite character on the show, and now I just hate him. If he's not making stupid decisions, he's blaming other people for his stupid decisions- like, hi, you can't get mad at Sylar for his ability when you made him give it to you. You know something's wrong when I'm rooting for Sylar to win in a fight between the two. The only hope I have for getting interested in Peter again is if he regains his "natural" power (power copying), but not all the ones he's absorbed, meaning no Sylar power and Peter's not uber-powerful again. If they do that, maybe he can be redeemed as a character. Hiro's storyline made me laugh in spite of seeing the shovel hits coming a mile off, and I was surprised that they killed David Anders off so quickly. But, okay, two things that struck me as just incredibly "please don't notice how dumb this is," and maybe those moments have always been there and I'm just noticing them now, but geez. One: Puppet Master escapes level 5 and immediately goes back to his old hideout, a creepy puppet shop, that's apparently within driving distance of where he was imprisoned. Like, oh, good point, they'll never think of looking for you there. What? When we didn't know he was an escapee that made sense, but they explicitly stated he was last night. Did he WANT to be recaptured? And two, Jessica taking Mohinder's hand and then freezing it. It's like, I'm sorry, Mohinder- I know you're new to being a bad guy, but you have to learn these tricks the heroes are going to pull on you. And that particular trick is the oldest one in the book... in fact, it predates the book. You SAW her demonstrate her power to freeze things not an hour ago, and you think she's trying to comfort you for her health? I know he was conflicted, but come on... wasn't Mohinder smart at one point? Anyway, those gripes aside, it did still keep me interested. (Daphne's subplot and conflicted conscience was nice.) However, I'm still ready for a big Heroes/Villains showdown, and if they yank the rug out from under us on that count, I think they're going to have a LOT of disappointed (possibly ex-) fans. -D |
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Post by StarOpal on Oct 21, 2008 9:26:45 GMT -5
Silence you! If the set designers want to do a puppet themed room, then they'll dang well do a puppet themed room! And I mean it would be some crazy coincidence if he just stumbled upon a puppet palace, now wouldn't? Obviously, Drew. But yeah it was like Block 5? Really? I know he was conflicted, but come on... wasn't Mohinder smart at one point? Not that I ever remember, but now he's gotten really stoopid. |
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